http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110124/ts_afp/icoastpoliticscrisisnigeriaun_20110124102240
IMO, this is Nigeria, basically, requesting for financial backing from the international community before embarking on the military excursion. This recent episode in Ivory Coast has called into my question my personal belief in self-determination. When the US invaded Iraq in 2003 using the fiery sentiment whipped up in the aftermath of 9/11 to bulldoze any opposition, I was adamantly against it. This was not because I had any love for Saddam Hussein. Instead, I questioned the US's right to impose what amounted to civil war on the Iraqi people. However, in this case, I'm all for a quick effective military campaign to depose Gbagbo.
Why?
After reading the article, I had an interesting comment thread with some passionate Ivoriennes going by the monikers "Gborosso" and "Maurice". I think the comment thread lays out my general reason for desiring a military operation to resolve the impasse in Ivory Coast, pretty nicely.
Gorosso:
Who is Nigeria? A country where muslims and christians are always killing each other. No democracy. And you are the one who calls on UN to establish democracy in Ivory Coast? Let your army come and establish Ouatara. You will learn that day that Ivory Coast is no joke. During slavery it was african themselveswho sold their brothers to white men. Thats what you are trying to do right now. But Ivory Coast will be where all this necolonialism will be destroyed because we ivorians are standing up for our right and will fight you and your bosses UN, France, USA no matter what army will come in
Me:
What a bunch of Bull@#$%!!!!!
Gbagbo doesn't have have the backing of the entire Ivory Coast! Just the south!
Now I can tell that you are from the south of Ivory Coast and feel passionately about your support from Gbagbo, but that is what DEMOCRACY is! In a real democracy, not everyone wins! Africa has to get past taking elections as a do-or-die zero-sum game.
I am from Nigeria, and I can assure you that we have our own share of tribalism-based north-vs-south elections here! It will not be the end of the world if a Northerner or a Southerner becomes president. The real tragedy comes when your country cannot even hold a simple election without an impasse and potential civil war!
You have a point that we in Nigeria have our own problems with elections. The same issues plaguing Ivory Coast occurs (to a lesser extent since we haven't descended into civil war sine the 60s) in Nigeria, with people reluctance to let people from other tribes ascend to power. A Northerner was elected president of Nigeria in 2007. And I'm from the south but it wasn't the end of the world for me. It shouldn't be!!! Africa has to get over that or we will always have war on our continent!
And finally, the main reasons why ECOWAS (which practically means Nigeria forces) hasn't invaded and captured Gabgbo already is not because they are wary of Ivorian forces loyal to Gbagbo (Ask Liberia and Sierra Leone); Several reasons exist; Nigeria is afraid of civilian casualties which is inevitable in urban fighting, the cost of the military expedition would be high (that's why they want a UN security mandate), and because an election is coming up in a couple of months in Nigeria!
Don't think for a second that if ECOWAS did go in with full force, Gbagbo wouldn't be in handcuff in the Hague within a week (Ask Charles Taylor), and life would go on in Abidjan, because isn't it just another war in Africa!!
Gbagbo doesn't have have the backing of the entire Ivory Coast! Just the south!
Now I can tell that you are from the south of Ivory Coast and feel passionately about your support from Gbagbo, but that is what DEMOCRACY is! In a real democracy, not everyone wins! Africa has to get past taking elections as a do-or-die zero-sum game.
I am from Nigeria, and I can assure you that we have our own share of tribalism-based north-vs-south elections here! It will not be the end of the world if a Northerner or a Southerner becomes president. The real tragedy comes when your country cannot even hold a simple election without an impasse and potential civil war!
You have a point that we in Nigeria have our own problems with elections. The same issues plaguing Ivory Coast occurs (to a lesser extent since we haven't descended into civil war sine the 60s) in Nigeria, with people reluctance to let people from other tribes ascend to power. A Northerner was elected president of Nigeria in 2007. And I'm from the south but it wasn't the end of the world for me. It shouldn't be!!! Africa has to get over that or we will always have war on our continent!
And finally, the main reasons why ECOWAS (which practically means Nigeria forces) hasn't invaded and captured Gabgbo already is not because they are wary of Ivorian forces loyal to Gbagbo (Ask Liberia and Sierra Leone); Several reasons exist; Nigeria is afraid of civilian casualties which is inevitable in urban fighting, the cost of the military expedition would be high (that's why they want a UN security mandate), and because an election is coming up in a couple of months in Nigeria!
Don't think for a second that if ECOWAS did go in with full force, Gbagbo wouldn't be in handcuff in the Hague within a week (Ask Charles Taylor), and life would go on in Abidjan, because isn't it just another war in Africa!!
Maurice:
Tallest4ever it saddens me that you don't see what is happening in the mother land. As brothers and sisters of humanity have you EVER heard of a military intervention as a way to a means due to POLITICAL issue?? NO.. Have you seen military intervention over a ECONOMIC interest (ala Iraq, Afghanistan etc) YES...
Wake up my brotha/sister and HOPE that Nigeria will be able to take precaution over its own election so to rid itself of voter irregularities that include, violence, fear, fraud and ghost poll stations..
Also, maybe you should so some research and google this article below published in Washington Post (a very credible source..)
THE UN DEFRAUDS ELECTIONS: AFGHAN ELECTION LESSONS -
Galbraith, the U.S. Special Representative to Afghanistan, was announced as the next United Nations' Deputy Special Representative for Afghanistan on March 25, 2009 but abruptly left the country in mid September 2009 at the request of UN Special Representative to Afghanistan Kai Eide following a dispute over the handling of the reported fraud in the 2009 Afghan presidential election - and on September 30, the UN announced that he had been removed from his position by Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon.
The United Nations fired Mr. Galbraith, its No. 2 official in Afghanistan, in September 2009 after he wrote a scathing letter accusing the head of the mission of concealing election fraud that benefited the campaign of the incumbent president, Hamid Karzai.
In response to his firing, Galbraith told The Times, "I was not prepared to be complicit in a cover-up or in an effort to downplay the fraud that took place. I felt we had to face squarely the fraud that took place
God bless
Wake up my brotha/sister and HOPE that Nigeria will be able to take precaution over its own election so to rid itself of voter irregularities that include, violence, fear, fraud and ghost poll stations..
Also, maybe you should so some research and google this article below published in Washington Post (a very credible source..)
THE UN DEFRAUDS ELECTIONS: AFGHAN ELECTION LESSONS -
Galbraith, the U.S. Special Representative to Afghanistan, was announced as the next United Nations' Deputy Special Representative for Afghanistan on March 25, 2009 but abruptly left the country in mid September 2009 at the request of UN Special Representative to Afghanistan Kai Eide following a dispute over the handling of the reported fraud in the 2009 Afghan presidential election - and on September 30, the UN announced that he had been removed from his position by Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon.
The United Nations fired Mr. Galbraith, its No. 2 official in Afghanistan, in September 2009 after he wrote a scathing letter accusing the head of the mission of concealing election fraud that benefited the campaign of the incumbent president, Hamid Karzai.
In response to his firing, Galbraith told The Times, "I was not prepared to be complicit in a cover-up or in an effort to downplay the fraud that took place. I felt we had to face squarely the fraud that took place
God bless
Me:
@Maurice,
I understand about election fraud / rigging etc! Hell, I am from Nigeria and an elections has never been held in Nigeria without some form of vote-rigging or fraud!
I will not deny that that doesn't occur in the world. For all I know, it occurred (to a certain extent) in this case! But again, I stress the point that the best thing about a REAL democracy is the potential short term of presidency. During the interval between elections, both sides need to work to strengthen the electoral institutions. Holding elections correctly takes practice. A culture of elections without resorting to unilateral actions like "refusing to step down" needs to be cultivated. If every election ended with the losers (valid or not) declaring that the election was rigged and vowing to go to war, we'd have war all the time!
Even if Gbagbo feels he is right, if he was a true patriot, he would step down graciously, form a valid opposition party with valid checks and balances on the new government, work to ensure the fairness of the next elections, and if he is confident of having the backing of a MAJORITY of the Ivorian people, run for elections in 4 years!
Let me ask you? Is 4 years in a presidency worth a ton of bloodshed? Is do-or-die politics the answer? For example, many people feel that Al Gore deserved the US presidency in 2000, did they resort to bloodshed when he didn't! Sometimes, being PATRIOTIC means taking one for your country and backing down for peace, and instead working to make sure that the next elections are more valid and credible. Maybe after a few questionable elections, the tradition of power transfer without bloodshed would become the norm. If Ivory Coast descends into a civil war, it will be back to square 1. Thousands will die and 10-12 years down the line, it would be back to this point again; waiting for REAL PATRIOTS to take one for their country and choose not to fight!
OR
We can just keep on the same path and wait for my country, financed by the UN, to turn your country into a warzone! Violence prevails again!
I hope you understand where I am coming from. I do not know Outtarra or Gbagbo! Until several months ago, I had never heard of them. But I can recognize the do-or-die nature of African politics which is the main problem here; and is the main problem hobbling Africa at the moment.
